Interview with Dr. W Robert Godfrey on Christendom & the Struggles with Sex, Race, Politics, & Power

I recently sat down with Dr. Robert Godfrey to discuss his series on the end of Christendom in America. If you haven’t listened to the seventeen lectures here is a recap of the crucial points made in the series. As always, Dr. Godfrey does not disappoint.


  1. Is it Christian values themselves that have been labeled as bigoted, hostile, and evil? Are people now hostile to the Christian practice of marriage and trying to follow Biblical sexual mores? Or is what is labeled as bigoted, hostile, and evil the imposition of Christian values on the rest of society?

    It seems to me that if people are simply opposing the imposition of Christian values on society, then they are not being anti-Christian. If they were persecuting us Christians because of our own religious practices and beliefs, that would be anti-Christian. And such a distinction is needed if we are to effectively read and react to what our society is saying to us.

    It seems to me that to interpret the mere rejection of Christian values on society as being anti-Christian means that we have assumed that Christianity deserves a place of privilege and supremacy over the rest of society. To interpret the rejection of our values as being anti-Christian implies that we have been robbed of our own perceived rightful place to rule the roost in our society. Thus we believe that it is below us to think of unbelievers and ourselves as deserving an equal footing in society. And so if anyone was following the alleged, Marxist position, alleged by Godfrey, that they knew what was true for everyone, it would those who imposed their values on everyone including those who disagreed. That means that is those who favor Christendom who have been acting like what was alleged to be Marxist.

    It also seems to me that, according to Godfrey’s comments on Dominionism, that Christendom was at least a mild form of Dominionism. And that what Kuyper was doing was promoting a mild form of Christendom.

    Kuyper wasn’t liberal. Rather, he believed that the state should at least partially support religion financially through his education proposals. The educational issue isn’t whether children belong to the state. Rather, the educational issue is that the state doesn’t support the imposition of a specific set of religious values on those who have other values. The issue is that the state should not support the privileging of one religion over other religions in society. And since there are many educational issues that lie outside the imposition of specific religious values on students or the privileging of a specific religion over others, parents of all religions have still have quite a bit of influence to have on public education.

    In essence Gordon and Godfrey do not fully understand what democracy is about. And thus what Godfrey complained about with the firing of a chaplain who was unfairly fired for exercising free speech is what Godfrey supports when he complains about the demise of Christendom or when he promotes Kuyper’s approach. Did Godfrey forget how the LGBT community suffered under Christendom? Others suffered too.

    In addition, Godfrey misses the basic concern of Marx. The concern for Marx was not economic liberation; that kind of liberation would be the natural result of following Marx’s approach. Marx’s concern was with the overthrow of the bourgeoisie and replace it with the proletariat dictatorship. It is political liberation, both at the workplace and in government, that is the main concern of Marx.

    Also, though ministers should not favor a given political ideology or party, ministers should speak out when injustices are taking place in society. Injustices are the result of corporate sins. And we should be warned against participating in corporate sins.

    Finally, what did Jesus tell us about those who desire to be great and have a recognized position of authority? He told us that those who seek to be great should serve others. Perhaps part of what we should be emphasizing is saving faith, how to serve, and how to recognize and respond to social injustices.

  2. I found the discussion between Dr. W. Robert Godfrey and Paster Chris Gordon extremely interesting and informative. The several topics covered helped me to understand what “Christendom” is and what has happened to it over the decades until today. I strongly encourage anyone who claims to be a Christian to listen to this discussion closely and be guided by what is taught.

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